Art or Blasphemy

[Hanzo23]

Ang argument na dapat tungkol sa isyung ito, biglang napunta sa aking lifestyle. 

your ability to understand concepts may need some work

The CCP exists at the service of the Filipino people, especially those who pay taxes for its upkeep. Majority of the Filipinos hold a value which the CCP-sponsored exhibit offends. Hindi rin naman issue dito kung pwede ba i-exhibit yung art sa pilipinas. We are a free country, so of course we can do anything so long as it is not criminal. . Ang issue is whether the CCP (which is publicly funded by a majority of Filipino catholics) can be used as a venue to hold such an exhibit that offends Catholicism.

You assume that all public funding are from Catholics, which is completely incorrect, besides it is PUBLIC funding, public in essence where it should be void of any religious objectives. Even if funding did come from Catholics, the public should be able to respect all forms of presentations there. You even said it yourself, it is a free country, it is hypocritical to state that a country that is democratic, has a separation of church and state, has a freedom of expression should restrict expressionism because of religious reasons.

Pwede naman sa lansangan, o sa bahay, but i dont see the reason why this publicly-funded building should host an exhibit that offends the public.

Should the venue matter? it is a publicly funded building, it is completely legal to do so.

Paano kung sabihin ko na for me, ok lang pumatay because in personally dont think its offensive? 

Again, you completely miss the point. Since when it is a freedom to kill someone? 

Oh yeah, you have a point. The Vatican (the authority of the Roman Catholic faith) is guilty of that throughout history. Just check their "very impressive" record. 

[Hanzo23]

^ they dont believe in religion in the first place, so for them, "respecting" religion really means respecting nothing.

My respect for a person's beliefs is separate from this issue. A person is free to believe whatever he wants to believe. When theocracy starts to take over for its personal gains, that is where I draw the line.

[definedelirium]

Ang issue is whether the CCP (which is publicly funded by a majority of Filipino catholics) can be used as a venue to hold such an exhibit that offends Catholicism.

YES because the last time i checked it's Cultural Center of the Philippines and not Catholic Center of the Philippines.

Would it make a lot of difference if it were shown in a different venue, say in a private gallery like Ayala Museum? the theme would be the same, the artworks shown would be the same but catholic ire will still happen because the cause of the 'problem' is still there. the ccp shouldn't favor one sector of society over another, even if that sector is the majority.

art is universal, it's just that people consider different things as art. so being literally the cultural center of the philippines, it supposed to be the job of the ccp to showcase the works of the filipino, whether it attacks the government, attacks the Church, promotes communism or whatever.

i am saddened the exhibit was taken down. one blow against freedom of expression in this country, where journalists are mowed down like weeds and where an artist cant show his work without fear of public castigation.

[pach]

If thats the case, pwede din naman sunugin ko yung bandila ng plipinas at i-display ko as art, or pahiran ko ng tae yung statwa ni rizal pero bakit ako makukulong pagka ginawa ko  yun? Is it not the case that i too am using imagery to express what i feel?

Double standard eh.



Cultural center of the philippnes diba?

Tell me.. In the history of the philippines, kelan naging parte ng kultura natin na paskilan ng etits yung imahen ni bathala, o Allah, o Hesukristo? 


Kaya nga tinawag na kultura. " culture" - para sa mga taong may pinag aralan.

[Hanzo23]

If thats the case, pwede din naman sunugin ko yung bandila ng plipinas at i-display ko as art, or pahiran ko ng tae yung statwa ni rizal pero bakit ako makukulong pagka ginawa ko  yun? Is it not the case that i too am using imagery to express what i feel?

Double standard eh.

Philippines Flag Law
SECTION 34. It shall be prohibited:
a) To mutilate, deface, defile, trample on or cast contempt or commit any act or omission casting dishonor or ridicule upon the flag or over its surface;

Use a better example next time. Artifacts that are used as a representation of a country or of its government are usually covered by special laws. Again, you are combining affairs that is church and state.

With regards to your example for Rizal, check with the Philippine laws first. I do not see any special laws in regards to that but defacing an actual monument is punishable by law. If you do it in another form, say by printing an image and using that as your art canvas for your preferred way to deface such an image, I have yet to see a law prohibiting that. Heck you can even draw horns and place a nice Hitler mustache to it and if it is done in freedom of expression, by the constitution you are allowed to do so.

Tell me.. In the history of the philippines, kelan naging parte ng kultura natin na paskilan ng etits yung imahen ni bathala, o Allah, o Hesukristo? 
Kaya nga tinawag na kultura. " culture" - para sa mga taong may pinag aralan.

Since when has been the Philippines the sole property or representation of the Catholic Faith? you are treating on very dangerous waters, you are inciting the ideologies of theocracy.

Ideologies, just like expressionism, are relative. They can change with the times, in the next hundred years or so, who knows if Catholicism will no longer be as conniving in the country?

Culture is only retained with people who are isolated to it. The more people are exposed to information, they more they understand and embrace different ideas.

[definedelirium]

before you get your panties up in a bunch, pach, let me put this discussion in context.

'Poleteismo,' the part of the exhibit in question, was a study of the things we idolize and how these affect our lives and was intended by the artist to spark critical thought. critical thought, pach, meaning people should let the entire thing sink in first and process their thoughts before crying foul. part of the critical thinking process should be to understand why you were offended by the exhibit. afterwards, reflect on how and why these images have such an impact on you and are these the sole basis of your faith? a picture of jesus christ? THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT THE EXHIBIT IS TRYING TO POINT OUT.

you are skewing the definition of culture to suit your own purposes. culture can mean different things, just like art. mideo cruz is a fine arts graduate of UST; if i'm going by your definition of culture then mr. cruz is a very cultured person. does that then mean that the uneducated at payatas cannot appreciate and cannot have culture? of course not.

you forget that making something and calling it as art does not automatically make it a work of art. you can burn the flag and display it as 'art' but without the meaning and the intention behind it it's just that, a burnt flag. while art can be made of anything, concept, meaning and intention separate art from decorative objects or publicity stunts. there is no double standard here; in fact, i would even venture a guess that if mr. cruz used different images, say that of marylin monroe or another celebrity, you wouldn't be up in arms about this.

bago magalit, mag-isip muna. tell me, is to write messages like 'bakla parusahan ka' on the exhibit walls a catholic way of dealing with it? the Church lashes out violently at things that go against its teachings but thinks it's free from criticism. where is the double standard now?

[airish_2]

whatever his reason hindi pa rin tama ang ginawa nya, for example kinuha ko picture ng nanay mo then i put condom matutuwa ka ba? kung para sa akin art yun. meron syang message na gustong iparating i think he is attention seeker. so masaya na sya ngayon? natural lang naman ng maraming mag-rereact maraming catholic at christian dito yung medium at subject na ginamit nya hindi tama.

[definedelirium]

whatever his reason hindi pa rin tama ang ginawa nya, for example kinuha ko picture ng nanay mo then i put condom matutuwa ka ba? kung para sa akin art yun. meron syang message na gustong iparating i think he is attention seeker. so masaya na sya ngayon? natural lang naman ng maraming mag-rereact maraming catholic at christian dito yung medium at subject na ginamit nya hindi tama.

this is exactly the kind of thinking that the artist wants to challenge. what is an acceptable picture to put beside a condom then? a photo of a naked lady? isipin mo muna kung bakit ka nagalit na picture ng nanay mo ginamit. kasi nanay mo yun diba and you respect her. kaya ka nainis kasi you associate a condom with 'bad' things and you perceive that by putting that right next to a photo of your mom is besmirching her good name. now, see how these images affect you. those two things are harmless by themselves, pero pag pinagsama nagagalit ka. that photo is not your mother, that is just a representation of her but why are you allowing it to have such power on you? the same way that the artist wants to point out how people revere images/statues of jesus christ/FPJ/etc and yet idolizing these things isn't what their faith/admiration is about. it goes deeper than that. so why are people stopping at a superficial level?

[fluffyheart]

it's an art. a sick art made by a very CIVILIZED and NOBLE artist. bravo.
didn't care that he violated some people's sensibility just for the sake of "art".

[phantomknight]

Yan ba talaga ang "art"? Expressing your own feelings without minding others? Sabihin na nating image lang yun pero... mali bang magalit? Let's just say you don't want to respect their religion but at least, respect the people themselves. Di ba ang "art" ginagamit upang mapasaya at mabigyan ng good feeling ang makakakita nito? Yun ang pagkakaalam ko. Ngayon ba eh pag na-express mo lang yung sarili mo not minding others eh "art" na? Is "art" all about expressing yourself?

[Hanzo23]

Yan ba talaga ang "art"? Expressing your own feelings without minding others? Sabihin na nating image lang yun pero... mali bang magalit? Let's just say you don't want to respect their religion but at least, respect the people themselves. Di ba ang "art" ginagamit upang mapasaya at mabigyan ng good feeling ang makakakita nito? Yun ang pagkakaalam ko. Ngayon ba eh pag na-express mo lang yung sarili mo not minding others eh "art" na? Is "art" all about expressing yourself?

It is the primary goal of art. To be able to express yourself. Whether you offend others, it is irrelevant at that point. I would recommend you to see the German Bernt Notke's Danse Macabre.

Personally, art is supposed to allow the artist to express his message and convey it through his work. He may offend some, he may attract some. Again, this is relative to the eyes of the beholder.

[*Miel*]

We talked about this in our Art App tapos yung prof ko friend niya yung artist. He said that all that the artist showed are just things you can find in Quiapo sabi niya, "Pumunta lang daw doon si Mideo at namili sa Quiapo then he put everything he got in his installment". May mga bagay sa kaniyang installment na agree ako pero some of the things in his installment is kinda too much already